The Wilbur Smith Discussion Forums

I'm going to be honest here & admit I really don't remember much of what happened in this book, except for the creepy Umlimo character & her prophesy, which I never understood.

Am wondering what everyone thought of the history in this particular re: Rhodes & company? & their dealings with Lobengula.

I'm finally re-reading the book and am half-way through alaready!

Must say I'm at a point where I'm so suprised that Zouga doesn't just shoot himself - poor man has been through so much. Of all the WS heros, he somehow feels more human to me than all the others.



Will report back with more!

I finished the book on the weekend - gave it an 8.

I forgot how visceral and powerful it was. Ralph's character epitomises so much of what has happened in Africa.

The depiction of Lobengula I found a little hard to believe - seemed so dramatic, but I guess WS was trying to make a point with it.

Rhodes was as ever - unlikeable. I found it hard, but him and Ralph are very much the same people. Sucks because there is much to like about Ralph.

I just never saw how he turned into someone who just wants more for the sake of it. His friendship meant something to him, yet he admited that it really didn't when he realised he may have shot Bazo. I still can't wrap my mind around that complexity.

Am off to start the next book... so much for spending my 3 hr break @ uni catching up on work!

Overall this book was good; although I actually read it before I read A Falcon Flies; so I ended up flipping through it again. If the Ballantyne books are a fairly accurate description of Zimbabwe's history (a bit of poetic licence aside) then it is absolutely fascinating. I was shocked by how both Zouga and Ralph seemed to betray their friends Gandang and Bazo and Lobengula . . . or have I misinterpreted the whole thing?

I do have some comment on one tiny passage within the book - the part where Robyn Codrington, upon finding out about her husbands death, had sex with the man who told her of his death within minutes of hearing it. The man who told her was none other than Mungo St John; who she abhors because of his history as a slave trader. I laughed so much at this point; I just could not believe that a woman who hates a man so much, would have sex with him the day he tells her about her husbands death (of which Mungo was responsible, although Robyn did not know that). This one little passage just defied belief. And then she married him, happily allowing him to act as a step father to Clinton Codrington's daughters? Sorry . . . I just found that segment totally unbelievable. I know Wilbur is sexist, and I know that he is allowed to write a story as he sees fit, but this was aspect just lacked credibility.

Overall though, the book is good. The myths regarding the Umlimo and the falcons throughout give the Ballantyne series an air of fantasy that is missing from Wilburs other books.

Cheers,

Craig (aka Joachy)

Well... what to say. I really enjoyed Men of Men, the plot was well developed and the way he showed the progression of greed really drew me in. Overall I rated it a 8 on the WS scale of books

joachy wrote:O
I do have some comment on one tiny passage within the book - the part where Robyn Codrington, upon finding out about her husbands death, had sex with the man who told her of his death within minutes of hearing it. The man who told her was none other than Mungo St John; who she abhors because of his history as a slave trader. I laughed so much at this point; I just could not believe that a woman who hates a man so much, would have sex with him the day he tells her about her husbands death (of which Mungo was responsible, although Robyn did not know that). This one little passage just defied belief. And then she married him, happily allowing him to act as a step father to Clinton Codrington's daughters? Sorry . . . I just found that segment totally unbelievable. I know Wilbur is sexist, and I know that he is allowed to write a story as he sees fit, but this was aspect just lacked credibility.

I think on this point you are not taking history into account. Have you read A Falcon Flies yet? If you haven't I don't want to ruin it for you but they have a past and that is the reason for her reaction to Mungo. This even continues into The Angels Weep but that is another story. I can see her powerful reaction considering the circumstances.

Just finished "Men of men", and I must say it is amongst the best books I have read.



I gave it a 9/10.

I also gave this A nine only one thing spoiled it for me


sorry I forgot that what spoiled it for me could be a spoiler duh(slaps dumb head)

Just starting out on this book now, already Zouga's character is being developed. It seems a really interesting story line at the moment. And reading this reminds me why Wilbur's Stand alone books are not quite as good as the series, you have so much more time to get to love or hate each character in the series books. The prospect of reading men of men and finding out how Robyn, Clinton and Mungo are doing is a lot more exciting now, because of A Falcon flies.

OOOH JOhn I wash I was starting men of men for the first time

It was the last one of the four I read so it was like a gap filler and answered alot of questions for me

I really should learn to read series in order but I have no self control

lol yeah it would help del if u read them in the right order!

I took a little break from Wilbur after “A Falcon Flies” and today I’m starting “Men of Men”. I hope my favorite characters from the first book. Codrington and Mungo come back to action!

Men of Men was written for men who know Africa, by a man who was born in Africa, for men who love Africa and understand the way it is. For those who struggle to understand such things as the 'Umlimo' and the aspirations of Rhodes at the time? Perhaps you should stick to 'jolly old Biggles', or a good old PC 'Secret Seven' - or was that part of Robyn's sex scene? Sounds like you wouldn't understand that either.

jeffw wrote: For those who struggle to understand such things as the 'Umlimo' and the aspirations of Rhodes at the time? Perhaps you should stick to 'jolly old Biggles', or a good old PC 'Secret Seven' - or was that part of Robyn's sex scene? Sounds like you wouldn't understand that either.

Not really sure who you're criticising Jeffw, but seeing as though all the reviews of the book are extremely positive I think you're probably getting the wrong end of the stick.

jeffw wrote: Men of Men was written for men who know Africa, by a man who was born in Africa, for men who love Africa and understand the way it is.

Do you really believe this?! I think that's a very naive point of view to take. Wilbur Smith is an international best-seller, his books have widespread appeal to numerous market segments - different age groups, genders and geographical locations. How can you explain Wilbur Smiths success if his books are only aimed at (and understood by) men who know and understand Africa?

People who have never been to Africa can easily enjoy (and understand) this book just as much as someone who "knows" Africa, I know...I'm one of them.

I am a woman that was given Monsoon several months ago, and to date have read all of the Courtney and Ballantyne series. These are books for anyone that loves to read, enjoys interesting characters, marvelous locations, and appreciates someone who knows how to write. I think Wilbur Smith fits the bill.

I loved the Ballantyne series, not quite as much as the Courtneys. I wasn't crazy about the first one, A Falcon Flies, but thoroughly enjoyed Men of Men, The Angels Weep, and The Leopard Hunts in Darkness.

Perhaps others disagree, but I think to really understand the characters, these books must be read in order, and also to get the appropriate feel for the country and the times.

I had never been particularly interested in Africa, but since reading Wilbur I have found myself searching on the net for other information, for example reading more about Cecil Rhodes, which I thoroughly despised. (By the way, Ralph's brother is Jordan.) In fact, except for the unrest I would really like to visit Africa. And I would really like to meet Wilbur Smith' he must be fascinating.